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Post by sanfran on Dec 30, 2023 12:53:25 GMT -5
We had a rough and slow start to the transition to OOTP. Once we got the league settings down and everyone successfully tested, the league started and pretty much ran without a hitch. I didn't hear any issue with the weekly sims. I presume everyone got more comfortable with the league through the season.
What I'd like below is any feedback for how we can improve for 2024. What didn't work well. What you still don't like about OOTP. Options/updates we should consider for next season.
Expect the new version release in mid-March with an early May start date? That's 2 months earlier than this year.
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Post by bluejaysgm on Dec 31, 2023 18:08:07 GMT -5
Figured out how to use it well enough to send in lineup. Have no idea if the hot/cold, other items like that do anything.
Would still rather go back to DMB.
I think I only turned in one update the last 10 or so weeks.
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Post by LA Angels GM on Dec 31, 2023 20:27:16 GMT -5
Can you see when people turned in updated lineups? Would you say there were more, fewer, or about the same number of lineup changes with OOTP versus DMB?
For the record, I much prefer OOTP. I wasn't super invested for the first 3/4 of the season, but that was just because I was burnt out. Once I dropped MLBSA, I was able to get my interest piqued again.
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Post by Texas GM on Jan 1, 2024 9:24:52 GMT -5
Figured out how to use it well enough to send in lineup. Have no idea if the hot/cold, other items like that do anything. Would still rather go back to DMB. I think I only turned in one update the last 10 or so weeks. Same here. To me OOTP feels like I’m playing an MLB the Game video. I’m a member of the DMBO league and all it’s done is show how realistic a well run DMB can be v any other platform. The bottom line is OOTP hasn’t brought more ownersor spark more league interest here. The DMB format wasn’t broken, rather, it just wasn’t being managed to its fullest extent. Also, it bothers me greatly that all our years of zips analysis and roster building it thrown out for this unrealistic player rating at OOTP. I honestly don’t know how long I’ll be continuing here and that really bothers me to stay. I’ve been loyal and active here and just wish we were running on a well organized and sustainable DMB platform that was showing potential new owners that this was the place to be. I really like all the owners, the characters, the banter and the knowledge here, but I feel that all we did was trade out of an older Mercedes into a new Kia, instead of putting the work into the Benz. |
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Post by yankees on Jan 1, 2024 12:24:32 GMT -5
After week three and the update I never got to work I never even looked at it I just looked at the email and said I suck. I like the new system when I was able to use it. I used the web link to look at standings and stats.
I will be in for what ever we do but just need it to work to be more involved.
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Post by nestorm15 on Jan 2, 2024 7:39:15 GMT -5
I loved how easy it was to submit lineups. I did several every week. I would go back and tweak and resubmit. With DMB it was such a pain to me. I usually submitted 1 a month. I just hated the process. I actually like everything about this new program other than not using zips. That will take some time to learn. I have tried to get people to join, but not many want to put the work in. I get a little interest until I tell them its not like yahoo fantasy baseball, its like owning a real team. That's work. I don't have that much time to invest, etc. I think unfortunately we are a dying breed. I have been playing fantasy sports since 1998. I have run numerous yahoo leagues. It takes time to adjust and find committed owners, all while hoping the league doesn't fold in the mean time.
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Post by Elephanti! on Jan 2, 2024 9:58:31 GMT -5
I thought the OOTP season was pretty smooth once it got rolling. It's much more convenient to update rosters now.
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Post by BrewCrewGuru on Jan 2, 2024 21:00:59 GMT -5
I prefer DMB, but acknowledge that we would need to find someone who wanted to run simulations. I'm just burned out of a leadership role. I'm so grateful Travis stepped up the way he did to give us this season.
I like OOTP because of the ease of lineup changes. I like having the interface to view stats and stamina. I enjoy the video game like ratings systems because I always wanted our version of DBM to feel more like a video game simulation than something purely trying to mimic real life. I was please with how OOTP let us handle unowned teams by simply setting a 26 man roster and letting it go (effectively the same thing in DMB, but this felt different).
I'm going to be here no matter what the decision. I also have some feels bad about all the years of figuring out ZiPS numbers translating into DMB and it not being perfectly relevant in OOTP.
I also just want to state here that I was the architect of that Detroit team and I do not understand how that hot mess of a pitching staff did anything to support that amazing lineup. I'm still going to take some credit for those 87 wins so I feel less bad about tanking in MIL.
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Post by Pirates GM on Jan 11, 2024 20:29:48 GMT -5
First off, a huge thanks to Travis for essentially saving the league. This DMB to OOTP transition came at a time when a lot of guys seemed to be burned out running the league, but a ton of time was needed to understand how to transition to OOTP. Were it not for Travis, I don't think we would've had a season this year. Exemplary work, T-man.
I'm probably closer to Mark's point of view than anyone in this thread, while also acknowledging what Sean said that we were forced into this. DMB gets slower and slower rolling out their season disc, and I believe two years ago, it didn't come out until June. That also costs us GM participation, because we're getting a 2 month-late head start every season.
1. I don't like the OOTP interface nearly as much as DMB. Like Mark said, it feels more like a video game. OOTP has a ton of unnecessary features that you might use in a single-player game, but are borderline irrelevant in our sim. They just add clutter and confusion.
2. I miss the simple interface of DMB. It feels like there are 3-4 ways to do every single thing in OOTP, and every one of them is multi-step.
3. The only feature I really do like in OOTP is allowing the bench coach to set your depth charts. I loathed that part of DMB, so that saves me a ton of time.
4. I'm sure this happened to everyone, but OOTP killed my player ratings vs. what I was expecting in DMB. I had multiple guys who had above average ZiPS that wound up with below average to poor ratings in OOTP.
5. Moving to OOTP has all but eliminated the excitement of ZiPS releases, which used to be the best part of the offseason. Dan probably still lives in a loft above his parent's garage, but I miss that son of a gun.
6. Please let's consider changing player ratings from standard 20-80 to the wider range of 1-100 for next season. As I expected, 20-80 bunches players way too close together, and 80% of players wind up in the 45-55 range, with a ton of actual production variance between them.
Thanks guys,
JIm
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Post by Cubbies on Jan 18, 2024 20:36:08 GMT -5
I know the loss of looking forward to the ZiPS releases sucks, I enjoyed the shit out of those and still look at them. But OOTP still uses them, they just adjust them for their projections.
I will say though, that I preferred the simulations that OOTP put out. Players seemed to sim much closer to what I expected them too. We've all complained for years about how shitty DMB simmed and how far the gap was between sim and projection. I think OOTP simmed much closer to projections.
I admit though, the program is a bit much. I think most of us are in a place where we want something more than DMB offers, but less than OOTP. We want something mid. But when given an option, I think I'd prefer the program that gives us a ton of options that we don't use, than not even having the option to use them. Things like how to use a bullpen, more realistic fatigue, etc.
Honestly though, I just wish OOTP released or posted their projections somewhere that we could use when doing free agency.
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Post by Elephanti! on Jan 21, 2024 9:46:48 GMT -5
Yeah, I think we need to think about delaying free agency until the disk releases. Or at least have a supplemental free agency once it does.
I know the big lesson for me is to not bid on fringe major leaguers/AAAA types who happen to get solid projections.
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Post by phillies17 on Jan 21, 2024 15:30:40 GMT -5
I did not really enjoy using OOTP this year. I felt it was a poor simulation tool overall and much better suited as a video game. I do not believe it meshed well with our external league and roster management. We barely used any features of OOTP, which is the main driver for players using OOTP in the first place. The entire league process may need to be overhauled in order to utilize more of the tools and features of the new system.
I felt the roster I built on paper using ZIP's and other projection systems looked nothing like the result based roster in OOTP. My best SP was a guy I was prepared to cut because he no longer played in MLB, yet he had somewhat good rankings in OOTP, AI promoted him, and the simulation heavily favored his skill set which I have no idea how to emulate going forward in future roster builds. I hated my team in OOTP so much I gave up pretty early. I don't know if I'm prepared to rebuild it to function in the OOTP world without knowing ahead of time their player values.
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Post by Pirates GM on Jan 30, 2024 20:23:44 GMT -5
I did not really enjoy using OOTP this year. I felt it was a poor simulation tool overall and much better suited as a video game. I do not believe it meshed well with our external league and roster management. We barely used any features of OOTP, which is the main driver for players using OOTP in the first place. The entire league process may need to be overhauled in order to utilize more of the tools and features of the new system. I felt the roster I built on paper using ZIP's and other projection systems looked nothing like the result based roster in OOTP. My best SP was a guy I was prepared to cut because he no longer played in MLB, yet he had somewhat good rankings in OOTP, AI promoted him, and the simulation heavily favored his skill set which I have no idea how to emulate going forward in future roster builds. I hated my team in OOTP so much I gave up pretty early. I don't know if I'm prepared to rebuild it to function in the OOTP world without knowing ahead of time their player values. This is a very insightful post. That second paragraph in particular hit home. JIm |
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Post by BrewCrewGuru on Jan 30, 2024 22:26:28 GMT -5
I am not going to argue against the differences between the simulation programs. There are a lot.
I will say that we surived the switch from DMB generated disks to ZIPs disks. Like it fucked me up for multiple years figuring out that I needed to draft different and sign different players. I had 100 win seasons with a few stars surrounded by AAAA guys with good numbers from the DMB disks. I haven't done much beyond some high 80s seasons since. Still having fun though trying to figure it all out.
A lot of our farm system work is still good. The future of our teams is still ours to dictate. The Brewers are coming for y'all!
Sorry for being the cheerleader to keep the band together. I respect y'all too much to dimish what you're feeling, but I still want everyone to stay.
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Post by KC Royals Nate on Feb 22, 2024 1:13:17 GMT -5
Chiming in way late - I did like the S1.NSBL.2023 experience with OOTP. Maybe because my team played well, but damn it was easy to make a change and reupload after you looked at your team again, rather than send an email and retitle and hope your update was caught. I went in thinking that OOTP was pretty tied to Zips, but once we got the disk, it certainly looks like OOTP puts their own spin on some players. I guess that can be a plus or a minus - you spend our league $$ and hope your guy sims good, but when we are staring at Zips and paying for that, and then getting a lesser version we feel screwed.
I'll be back and giving it another go. I'm not sure there is much i would change - i do enjoy the extra flexibility in pitcher/roster management with OOTP (more control over where guys pitch, play, etc).
My one difficulty this year was I never sent in an update as to who was moving to and from my roster on a weekly basis - which was super easy when you were already sending an email with a MP. This year having to take an extra step and post - i just never did. That's not fair to the league - I showed on the roster all year I had more $$ than i ended with. Thanks to Travis (I assume) for going back and adjusting all my guys who got called up and has them in their right place on the new roster. I wish there were a simpler way for us to navigate the roster thig, but maybe as time goes it will get easier
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